This week we are discussing Big Fat Manifesto by Susan Vaught Chapter 7 - Chapter 13.
Spoiler Warning!!! This post is full of spoilers for Big Fat Manifesto by Susan Vaught.
Trigger/Content Warning!!! Fatphobia, Disordered Eating, Surgery, Panic Attacks, Mental Health
Discussion #2:
Michaela: Hello friends! Welcome to our second discussion of Big Fat Manifesto. To preface our discussions with some honesty. I have been finding this book both difficult to read and liberating at the same time, which Jacilyn just said to me the other day. It's difficult to read because I can see myself in certain things Jamie does or how she thinks, especially when I think back to how I was in high school. And at times it can be painful or anxiety inducing to read. That being said I am also really enjoying this book. I really like how much of a personality Jamie has and how real the author writes her inner monologue. Because the book is in first person, we really get to see how thoughts lead into other thoughts and circle right back to the main thing you’re worried about. It’s almost exactly how I think and it makes it really interesting to read.
Jacilyn: It kind of goes back to what I was saying last week about the characters feeling very real and relatable. I’m finding Jamie’s relationships with Heath and Burke to be particularly interesting to watch evolve from her perspective. You can see the little tells of her changing perspective on both of them - finding Heath’s quirks to be “cute,” her noticing the distance in Burke’s eyes as he talks about his weight loss. Heath really likes Jamie, and he seems to be acting out of genuine concern for her. I mean, he knew how worried Jamie would be while Burke was in surgery and he physically showed up to give her support. It feels like Heath is treating Jamie like Burke used to. Seeing Jamie for everything that she is and loving all of it. I think Jamie is trying so hard to be supportive of Burke and stay by his side, but I don’t think it’s healthy for her. She’s finding comfort in Heath, and feeling really guilty for it. Freddie is right. Jamie needs to be honest with Burke and end it the right way before it goes too far with Heath.
Michaela: I really enjoy being able to see Jamie’s perspectives change. It's so interesting to read and it shows just how much you can’t help your feelings. They just happen. Jamie is trying so hard for Burke but I agree, I don’t know that it's healthy for her. Burke, and his whole family apparently, is super focused on weight loss right now, which while being understandable isn’t fair to Jamie. Especially when Burke told her that she could lose weight too and be like him. Huge, huge red flag and really rude. Jamie’s thoughts said it all “my curves were never unmanageable before”. Just because your body is changing and you’re happy about it doesn’t mean that everyone else should do the same or that they now should feel bad about themselves. I think I actually got angry when Burke said that, it's just not okay. It’s exactly what you said, Heath is treating Jamie like Burke used to. Loving what she looks like now and who she is now, not wanting her to “manage her curves”. Also, when Burke forgot about her opening night...my heart hurt for Jamie so much.
I think Freddie is right that Jamie should stay honest, but I can’t see why Jamie wouldn’t be. Even if she had kissed Heath I’m pretty sure she would have told Burke that it happened. I don’t see Jamie as someone who would outright lie like that. Also, I thought how Freddie acted at the hospital was actually pretty mean. She was showing extreme favoritism for Burke in that moment and not being a good friend to Jamie. There were so many other ways for her to approach the subject of Heath with Jamie without it being an outright accusation. That just was not fair. We as the readers know Jamie’s feelings but from the outside it really just looked like Heath was supporting Jamie. Heath having feelings for Jamie is not Jamie’s fault, whether she reciprocates them or not. You are allowed to support your friends even if you have feelings for them and Freddie being so outrightly rude and unfriendly to Jamie was just ridiculous and I hated it.
Jacilyn: I audibly gasped while reading when Burke told Jamie she could manage her curves. That would be such a horrible thing for someone you thought loved you to say. And then, of course, that awful news story broke and Jamie had to watch it with Burke and his family, immediately after Burke said that to her. Can you imagine? We’ll come back to the news coverage in a bit… there’s a lot to be said about that.
I can see Jamie drawing out her relationship with Burke and just becoming more distant while becoming closer to Heath. In some ways, I don’t think that’s entirely her fault, but she does need to be honest with herself soon so that she doesn’t lead Burke on unintentionally.
I’m a bit torn about that interaction with Freddie. I don’t think either of them were acting their best, which is understandable considering how important Burke is to the both of them. Freddie was absolutely wrong in choosing to throw accusations around at that moment. I think she’s in the right to point out that Jamie seems to be feeling some kind of way about Heath, and Freddie rightly feels protective of Burke’s feelings in this regard. But Jamie is Freddie’s best friend and she deserves for that to be a conversation where she can be honest about her conflicting feelings and struggles with Burke’s surgery.
Michaela: I think I would have cried if the person I loved told me something like that. I would be absolutely heartbroken and I don’t know that I could healthily be with someone who thought that about me. I can see Jamie getting more distant from Burke but I think it’s possible that Burke might also end things because he feels differently about himself and expects Jamie to want to change. I also thought Burke asking Jamie to bring him secret chocolate was not okay. He went through a traumatic surgery and Jamie went through the same traumatic surgery from a different perspective and then asking her to bring him chocolate which is a super risky thing when he hasn’t been approved to even have solid food yet let alone something with that much sugar. So not okay for him to even ask but also not okay for him to be doing that either. He could really hurt himself.
I think Jamie handles a lot of things, not necessarily in the wrong way but in an angry or “bitchy” way as Heath said once. I don’t think Jamie being defensive against Freddie was wrong because I perceived Freddie to be really unfair and accusatory. Freddie pointing out the feelings between Jamie and Heath is fine, and something I would expect you or our other friends to do as well, it's just how she did it that bothers me. I don’t think Freddie approached the Heath stuff from the perspective of being Jamie’s best friend but Burke’s, which would have pissed me off as much as Jamie and I would have been really sad about it. I think in that moment if it were me I would have felt like she chose Burke over me and wasn’t concerned about how confused I might be about it all. It was a very intense emotional day and Freddie took some of that out on Jamie in that moment and in turn Jamie did the same thing. The way Freddie approached it the second time was much more kind but still firm and that’s a much better and healthier way to communicate with friends. Now, how Jamie acted towards NoNo, that was not okay at all. NoNo wasn’t even involved in that fight and Jamie took her frustrations against Freddie and Burke out on NoNo and that’s not okay. She 100% needs to apologize to NoNo. Being yelled at or someone being mean to you because they’re mad at someone else is one of the worst feelings and NoNo didn’t deserve that.
And actually speaking of NoNo, I kind of feel like Jamie and Freddie don’t truly respect all her fears, practices, or life choices. Both girls will support her by making sure she has food to eat at their houses and taking her to protests but they kind of make fun of her in front of her face. It makes me uncomfy. The Hotchix leather clothes situation especially makes me so uncomfortable, they knew exactly what would happen to NoNo in that store and they let it happen just to get the reactions from everything. It's just icky.
Jacilyn: It’s totally not fair of Burke to ask Jamie, who is already fragile and scared in this situation, to do something “supportive” that may put him at risk. I know he went through something traumatic but he’s being selfish right now. He can’t look past himself enough to meaningfully interact with Jamie right now, and he’s completely blind to the pain she’s in.
The way Jamie and Freddie treat NoNo just makes me sad. You’re right, they don’t take her seriously, and they act patronizing towards her. She has strong convictions, and also happens to have a lot of phobias and triggers. None of that is her fault, and she deserves friends who support her goals and respect her experiences. Jamie owes NoNo an apology most of all. She has taken to treating NoNo a bit like an emotional punching bag throughout the course of this book and I’m not cool with it. I did appreciate that Burke’s sisters were taking NoNo’s college aspirations more seriously than Freddie was, even, though. I don’t think they treat Jamie fairly at all, but props to them for recognizing NoNo’s passions.
Speaking of treating people horribly…. I really thought that the woman who interviewed Jamie after opening night might actually portray the story fairly. I was clearly wrong. We have, again, a grown ass adult mounting a rather vicious media attack against a teenage girl on national television. The lack of ethics just blows my mind.
Michaela: I know Burke did research for this surgery. But what worries me is that he may not have considered the mental struggle that goes along with this surgery. You have to give up so much when it comes to food for a very very long time. I think most people think about the weight loss and the physical aspects of bariatric surgery or diets. However, there is a whole other side to it and that’s mental. Depending on your relationship with food it can be the hardest thing to do to put yourself on a diet or restrictive eating.
Something I definitely don’t think Burke considered, and something Jamie has been thinking about, is that the love language in their relationship seems to be centered around food and physical touch. One of which, food, Jamie has pointed out many times in her thoughts that she and Burke can’t relate with anymore. The other being physical touch is now being affected by how different Burke physically feels in Jamie’s arms and how differently she feels in his arms. On a surface level you may think “oh wow get over it he’s lost weight” but something you need to consider is how your relationships with others are broken down. You and your person, friend or significant other, have a relationship built on time, common life events, interests, and habits. For example, Jacilyn and I have been friends for a decade (time), we went to the same high school and college and lived together (common life events), we both love books amongst many other things (interests), and we both love driving around look at houses while chit chatting and eating garlic bread (habits). Our friendship is built on a decade of struggles, laughs, and common interests. Now if I all of a sudden absolutely hated books or going out to eat and I told Jac that doing those things wasn’t anything I want to do anymore, that’s a pretty big chunk of our relationship and history that’s just out the window and it's just an empty slot. Think of what’s important to you in your relationships and if they just disappeared, how would you feel? From that one thing, other things will start to slowly crumble. But from the outside it just looks like people are growing apart. This is exactly what is starting to happen to Jamie and Burke. Burke’s priorities have changed and in a way that Jamie doesn’t really feel comfortable with. And then on top of that Burke is starting (though only a little bit right now) to pressure Jamie into feeling like she needs to lose weight. It's a really hard thing to grow apart from a friend or loved one but it happens and this is often one of the reasons it starts, you lose one of your foundation blocks.
Also, how quickly Burke is physically changing and how quickly his mentality has changed. For Burke this is all great because he’s getting smaller but he still doesn’t seem to understand his relationship with food, i.e. the chocolate contraband request. If I were to get this surgery, (which I would not, I can’t fathom going through what Burke is going through) I would seek mental help and support as well as the physical help. It’s so important to remember that Burke is rapidly changing not only physically but mentally and Jamie is not. Jamie is still Jamie and hasn’t had a surgery that is changing how she functions everyday.
I was outrageously disappointed by that news woman. I feel so betrayed. I thought for a split second “yes finally someone who will be on Jamie’s side and actually talk about the point”. That hope dissolved so fast. It's utterly disgusting how these news sites are treating Jamie and just completely living up to the point of why she made this column in the first place.
Jacilyn: Your point about Burke and Jamie’s love language is spot on. I think that’s a really important way to look at relationships. I think there’s an expectation that you’re supposed to stick by and stay close to friends that you’re losing connections with, and I don’t think that’s a healthy expectation for anyone. It’s natural and perfectly okay to grow apart from people and I think that’s something that should be more normalized.
The news story on Jamie honestly has me questioning where the book will go next. I thought maybe Jamie’s message might be spread by the interview, but again, it was just twisted. The fatphobia behind the interview is obvious, and I’m really hoping that Jamie gets the validation she deserves by the end of the book.
We’ll be back next week with our third and final discussion of My Big Fat Manifesto. In the meantime, let us know what you’re thinking of the book so far!
Do you think Freddie was out of line? Do you ship Jamie and Heath? Let us know below!
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